Low Income - What does it mean in Wareham?

By Archangel | Nov 09, 2017

With all of the comments posted on this site about low income people; can anyone tell me what annualized income they believe would place someone in the category of being a "low income type"? I'm hoping for honest, straightforward answers to this question.

Comments (58)
Posted by: Cindy | Nov 10, 2017 07:06

I suppose that's in the eye of the beholder but here's how mass housing defines it for voucher and housing programs:  there are a number of links here that are informational.


Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 12, 2017 17:22

Perhaps when you see comments referencing "low-income" posted, you should ask the individual who posted the comment to define "what annualized income they believe would place someone in the category of being a "low income type"?

Posted by: Spherebreaker | Nov 13, 2017 08:11

like porn, you know it when you see it

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 13, 2017 09:25

The category cannot be defined by an income.  That would be unfair to good hardworking people that have a lower income and live responsibly within their means.  There is a big difference between low income and a "low income type".  I feel that I have covered the topic well in that response without any WBTS candor and could leave it at that.  But just incase...


Here's two scenarios to help better understand.  Forgive me if I get carried away.  Lets just say that there's an apartment building in town called The Woods of Brandy Hill.  In apartment #1 we have a nice family.  Dad works at a warehouse in the industrial park.  Mom works part time at a market.  Son is in the Middle School.  Daughter is at Decas. They have one car.  They manage to pay rent, pay for the car, buy food, etc.  They are responsible.  According to the chart, for a family of 4, they are low income.  Otherwise all is well. They are great members of our community.  They just happen to be categorized as low-income.  No big deal.


Now, in apartment #2 is a single woman with 3 kids likely from 3 different men.  Mom doesn't work much because she has 3 kids.  We pay her rent and buy her food.  Mom has a boyfriend.  He isn't the dad of any of the kids.  He lives there too, so we pay his rent and buy his food as well.  He is no fool.  While boyfriend sleeps in because he doesn't work much either, Mom waits for the bus with the kids in her pajamas.  She stands out there with the others just like her.  $800 iPhone in one hand, $5 cup of coffee in the other, and a cigarette from a $10 pack hanging out of her mouth.  Get the picture?  That's what the "low income type looks like".

Posted by: 181mph | Nov 13, 2017 13:15

and this ladies and gentlemen is  what is known  as profiling,, wbts, why don't you go back to the woods at brandy hill and profile the rest of the apartments so we can put all what you call undesirables on a bus and send them to where ever you think they should be sent, you really are a piece of work, y'all come on here and post all kinds of hate and personal opinions on people you judge by how they look/live,, a lot of people are having tough times by no fault of their own, but of course in your world, it does not matter, if someone is not up to your standards they automatically become trash, you are like the nosy old busy body,  there is one in every neighborhood, up in everybody's business without knowing anyone's personal situation, but it's your way or the highway

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 13, 2017 16:19

181, what part didn't you like?  What was described behind door #1 or door #2?  Come on.  You cannot possibly be defending the welfare baby mama epidemic with the bonus freeloading boyfriend.  That scenario is as common as the day is long around here.  If you are defending it, maybe it's you I see out there in your PJs blowing smoke in the faces of our future.  I thought my first paragraph and then my sensitive description of the nice family in apartment #1 would keep me from getting beat up.  Geeze...even when i try to be nice...

Posted by: Spherebreaker | Nov 13, 2017 16:28

181, Something you don't understand is there are many that are in that position due to their lack of work ethic, lack of personal responsibility , lack of values, lack of respect. There are folks that need a hand up and folks that are only looking for a handout, Wareham has far too many of the latter. You call if profiling, i call it opening your eyes to reality. WBTS #2 scenario is what you see, day in and day out.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 13, 2017 17:01

The question (discussion) that Archangel posted asked what annual income (annual dollar income range) readers believed would place someone in the category of low income. The question did not ask for stereotypical descriptions of the lifestyle of those whose incomes are believed to qualify for the category of "low income."


As for WBTS's "the category can not be defined by income" look again the category about which the question was posed is "low income." The word "low" is an adjective which defines the level of income which is being queried.


WBTS - Nice "try" but no cigar.





Posted by: Spherebreaker | Nov 13, 2017 18:12

The question has been answered.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 13, 2017 18:47



This has the potential to go in circles due to semantics.  I see reference to "low income people" and "low income types" in both Archangel's original post and in your comment.  My point was to explain that those terms are totally different.  Low income has a dollar range.  Low income types does not.  Quite possibly, someone that  makes good money but looks and acts a certain way can be a low income type.  Maybe someone that married well.  How's the saying go?  You can take the manure away from the farm but you can't take the stink out of the manure.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 13, 2017 19:14

"The report defines low-income working families as those earning less than twice the federal poverty line. In 2011, the low-income threshold for a family of four with two children was $45,622."


Using the same formula as above, but applying it to the 2017 Federal Poverty Guidelines (family of four $24,600.00 X 2 = $49,200.00) a family of  four earning an income less than $49,200.00 qualifies  as low income.


Quote in bold type from:


U.S. Low-Income Working Families Increasing

2017 Poverty Guideline Statistics from:
Simple, direct, factual answer, no one's living circumstance were profiled or stereotyped and I didn't have to try to be nice.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 13, 2017 19:54

You have defined low income very well.  Those stats are interesting.  Funny, on a side note, it wasn't too long ago when 50 grand was considered good money.

However, those stats have nothing to do with low income type..which was Achangel's question.



Posted by: Archangel | Nov 13, 2017 20:56

Yes; I do get the picture WBTS. I have always gotten the picture in relationship to the low-income comments posted on this site. That is exactly why I posted the discussion.


Thank you for the very informative information Cindy and Andrea.


Posted by: greycat | Nov 15, 2017 19:52

Does low income include a cell phone and a body covered with tattoos, smoking a MARLBORO while pushing an occupied  baby carriage to the beer store?  While this fictitious person is ultimately personally responsible for his or her behavior, it does not speak well for the parenting or education that should have avoided these circumstances.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 15, 2017 22:00

Greycat -  To answer your question as to whether of not the fictitious person you described is low income: according to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services if your fictional person is single and has an annual income of less than $24,120 then statistically they are considered low income. If however your fictitious person is single and has an annual income of $12,060 or less, they fall within the Federal poverty guidelines.


If your fictitious person is a member of a family or household and you would like statistical information regarding how that impacts whether of not they are considered low-income, the statistical information necessary to determine that can be found at the following website:




If you or others reading this would like more information about the degree to which  parenting, education, and other factors impact the life circumstances of those who statistically qualify as "low-income" or "meeting Federal poverty guidelines" an online search for "cycle of low income in the United States" and/or cycle of poverty in the United States' will provide a wealth of resources.



Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 16, 2017 09:16

Greycat, I thought I was the only one that saw stuff like that.  The fictitious is describing a common sight around here.  Such a sad situation.  How can that cycle be broken?

Posted by: cranky pants | Nov 16, 2017 09:31

Two old sayings that remind me of this situation.. It's not a direct correlation but it's close.

" You build it, they will come..."

" You pay peanuts and you'll get animals..."

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 16, 2017 10:24

Cranky, you also can apply your "build it they will come" saying to the other article on the housing project.  It is beyond logic why anybody would ever want to allow housing for more of them.



Posted by: cranky pants | Nov 16, 2017 10:32

I'm not trying to be stereotypical, no such thing as easy living today. It's unfortunate that they want to put lower income families on that stretch of road. There's nothing there for them. Lower income families generally don't have transportation or they share transportation. Now we're gonna have more foot traffic on route 28. Tell this Dakota group to go knock on Duxbury's door. There's nothing out there for lower income families either but at least it's a safer environment.

Posted by: Archangel | Nov 16, 2017 18:50

Let me pose the question differently. How much money does a Wareham family need to earn not to be stereotyped by you, WBTS?


Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 17, 2017 00:35



My alleged stereotyping has nothing to do with how much money a family earns.  I tried to make that clear when I described the family behind door #1.  There is nothing wrong with young couples, families, retirees, veterans, and people with disabilities that are technically low-income due to where they fall on the chart.  I am sorry that my normally satirical style makes it seem like I'd be opposed to that, I'm not.  It's fine with me.


The problem is not with the low-income people.  The problem is with the low-income types and an even worse category that hasn't come up yet.  What about "no-income" people?  That is what I described behind door #2.  Baby mamas on welfare, freeloading boyfriends,lazy system abusers, etc  We cannot have any more of them in any more of our housing in this town.


So I guess I need to correct my answers a bit.  I will stereotype someone if their earned income is $0 yet they live rent-free and eat for free, have an $800 cellphone, drink $5 cups of coffee, and smoke $10 packs of cigarettes on my dime.



Posted by: cranky pants | Nov 17, 2017 07:58

Unearned income credits anyone ?

Nevermind, you work too hard for that.

Posted by: Archangel | Nov 17, 2017 17:22

WBTS, when it comes to system abusers and fraud or criminal activity, which is what I think you are trying to say, I fully understand your point of view and agree that more needs to be done to correct those issues. I don't care for the "Warehamy" term because I think it reflects poorly on the town as a whole.The more the term is used, the more it is likely to become attached to all of us. Perhaps our neighbors in Marion, a more affluent community than Wareham, might begin using it in reference to anyone that lives in Wareham (even you).

Cranky, if you are referring to the earned income credit. Are you saying the that the working class families that receive it don't work hard?

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 17, 2017 21:34

Wareham by the Sea - you know people to be "no income" because, you have access to State of Federal financial records specific to them? You have access to their medical records, medical insurance information? You stand behind them in a grocery line, see they have food assistance, and don't understand that those who struggle with full time minimum wage jobs sometimes qualify for food assistance? You lurk around coffee counters and question those who buy a "$5.00 cup of coffee" as to their income? You hang around cigarette counters and ask those who purchase a pack of cigarettes for proof that they are employed? Or maybe you just look at someone, decide their clothing to be less than posh, their hair style less than classy, or the location at which you see them to be limited to use by only those people you assume to be, in your words, "no-income?"

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 18, 2017 08:37



Obviously I don't have access to records but let's just say that I know a few things. Through my employment and various social & living situations over the past 30 years. I have come to know and understand many shocking things in general and about specific people. Maybe my immersion has left me jaded?


Now, as far as the grocery store and the food stamps. I completely understand that good people struggle. They deserve the assistance. However, when I look in a carriage of someone with a food card and see all name brand junk food, frivolous items, and nothing healty I get a little agitated because my carriage contains healthy food, store brand items, and and items on sale. Yea, yea, who am I to judge what someone eats...I get that. Maybe a requirement of food assistance is a consult with a nutritionist. Less Ben and Jerrys and more apples. That would be a good investment because obese unhealthy people on welfare end up costing us more in the long run. No, I don't have stats to prove that. Just a hunch.


And for the coffee...as I leave for work each day with my brewed at home coffee in my travel mug. I see the same characters with their $5 cups out near their subsidized apartments. Some carrying trays of 4 back with them. That'€™s like $20! Come on. Buy a freaking Mr. Coffee machine at Walmart and spend more wisely. Yea, yea, who am I to judge what someone drinks. Maybe a requirement of welfare is a consult with a financial advisor. Simple math shows that a month worth of Dunkin could be a car payment!

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 18, 2017 15:12


Posted by: OnsetTogether | Nov 19, 2017 08:22

Greycat is an equal opportunity bigot, judges everyone. Good thing I don’t have an infant, or a tattoo. What is Greycat doing to proactively “avoid this situation”? Funding Planned Parenthood? Low cost childcare? Free Community College education? Funding Head Start? Volunteering at the Middle School to educate and empower young women?

Posted by: OnsetTogether | Nov 19, 2017 08:32

The other side of the coin of income for anyone is expenses. HUD lumps Wareham with Boston for Fair Market Rents, which for 2018 is $1,740 monthly for a two bedroom. This is more than the mortgage on a modest house. https://www.huduser.gov/portal/datasets/fmr/fmrs/FY2018_code/2018summary.odn

Rules for occupancy in affordable (it’s not low income. An apartment doesn’t have income) housing can and most be enforced, and no one not on the lease or not qualifying should be evicted. We already have enforceability, but the management needs to act professionally and do their job.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 19, 2017 15:17

The cycle must be broken and Onsettogether has the idea.  I know first hand  generations that have been in the system and do not know any better.  Educated and provide the tools.  I'd say to take it further than educating and empowering just the young women.  True, they get do get the raw end of the deal, but why not educate the young men on how to act.  How to be respectful and responsible.  I am appalled at the number of grown men  I've met around here that here that speak of their complex web of exes and multiple children.  Yet they continue an irresponsible life of partying and the same behavior that got them into the situation they are in.  Hard to believe such ignorance is so prevalent right here all around.


Posted by: 181mph | Nov 19, 2017 16:13

it really amazes me how many people will live in a place they have absolutely nothing good to say about, and don't actually do anything to change it, perhaps rather than spout all this hate and disgust with Wareham y'all should run for office and make change happen, or better still, leave and go to the city/town of your choice without all of wareham's problems, and we have wbts, who when he passes into the next dimension, his job will be with st peter, telling him which people will enter heaven, because he knows just what people do, how they live/act/work, by the coffee and cigs they smoke, well y'all have a nice holiday, when i return from my next job, i'll be sure to chek in to the wareham hate club to see what/who y'all have sentenced to death when i return, maybe i'll bring home a nice south american family and send them up to wareham to take advantage of your lo income housing

Posted by: OnsetTogether | Nov 19, 2017 17:02

181MPH please don’t judge all of us by the narrow-minded judgmental people, as we should not paint with a broad brush either. There are many good people who volunteer and work for the betterment of all, sometimes fighting upstream. Nights of Hospitality, Turning Point, the Boys and Girls Club and more are lots of people helping not judging. Register to vote, and help register others: it’s the best way of local empowerment, if we get good people to run.

Warehambythesea I believe that girls and women need empowerment because ultimately we need to be in charge of our own bodies, pregnancies, education and economic success. Boys and men need encouragement but they are born with the “power.” Help them use it for good.

Breaking the cycle of poverty has been debated by people and politicians for a century or more, we know how, but as as long as people stand outside and judge, I don’t know when.

Posted by: capecake14 | Nov 21, 2017 04:23



Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 21, 2017 09:32

Wareham is geographically beautiful yet demographically flawed. No secrets there. That is an unfortunate fact not an opinion.  Research the stats. Those that speak with some level of negativity are not doing it out of hate/disgust/despise, they are doing it out of frustration.  There is a big difference.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 21, 2017 16:36

Wow, Wareham by the Sea, there's no end to your determination to put down those you classify as less than you view yourself to be.

Consider your above statement which I now quote; "Wareham is geographically beautiful yet demographically flawed."

Now there's a statement that deserves some clarifying definitions:

demographically - in a way that relates to the structure of populations

flawed -blemished, damaged, or imperfect in some way

You think Wareham is geographically beautiful but the population is blemished, damaged or imperfect?

Just out of curiosity in what town would one find a “perfect” population?


Let me guess, would the answer be a town that's 100 percent "upscale?" 

Definitions for demographically and blemished are from bing.com

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 21, 2017 18:56

Wow, Andrea, you were quick to decipher that!  I'm not putting down anyone nor do I classify anyone as less than myself.  That would be wrong. You are quick to criticize although you are misunderstanding me a bit.  I've explained this before. It's been a cat and mouse thing for years between us. You are well read and I know that you keep up with the news.  I respect you and really take what you write into consideration.  With aforementioned respect, I don't mean to be cliche, but do you get out much? Maybe you are unaware of just how it really is.  That would explain your stance.  Maybe I hang/have hung with the wrong crowd...maybe I'm one of them!  Maybe not...Like I said in a previous post, maybe I'm jaded?


Wareham is the most beautiful town.  I've stated that many times on here.  It's geographically perfect.  I have many friends and family here that are perfect as well.  However, there's that certain something...I guess it adds to the mystique!


There is no perfect population, that's was a silly question.  There is no 100% upscale town as well.  There certainly are many nice towns with uneventful police logs, where people make a lot more money, and have more valuable houses than here, but that's not the issue.  That's actually what adds to the dichotomy. We have millionaires and million dollar houses just like Duxbury.  It's actually better than Duxbury around here because the ocean is much warmer and has so much more to offer. Wareham is wonderful for that stuff.  Yet within a 5 minute ride of that we have the antithesis. Once again, I'm not referring to good people that just aren't wealthy.  I'm referring to bad people living in many of our bad places doing bad things.  Half of the bad doesn't even make it to the news.  It ain't pretty. Maybe that's the part that you are not aware of...the part you don't understand.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 25, 2017 23:20

Wareham by the Sea – I’m catching up on comments after several busy days.

A few random thoughts in response to your comment immediately above:

First about your statement, which I now quote:

"I'm not putting down anyone nor do I classify anyone as less than myself."

Every time you label someone with terms like "Warehamy," "no-income," "low income types” or stereotype someone based upon the location at which they live, the food assistance card they hold in their hands, or the baby stroller they push, you classify them as less than yourself.

Second, regarding your statement, “I don't mean to be cliche, but do you get out much?”

1) You meant to be cliché.

2) Between 12 years of volunteer work in one of the poorest, most crime ridden areas of Boston; time spent as a volunteer for Turning Point; working in local retail alongside decent, hard working people who despite their full time employment had desperate need of safe affordable housing; several years as a journalist; 13 years living in Wareham, and 57 years living in Needham, I’ve had a lot of eye opening and at times gut wrenching experiences. I’m not naïve. I’m not lacking knowledge. I just have a value system that is very different from yours.

Posted by: momof2 | Nov 27, 2017 16:03

Andrea -- I haven't been commented recently as much as I have in the past but its nice to see your level head still here. I know we dont always agree but this comment is spot on.

Posted by: Swifts_Sheriff | Nov 28, 2017 06:08

Smitty, 57 years living in Needham ? Really yeah you know a lot about poverty. Yeah volunteering in Boston then heading home to Needham , you know what it's like ...

Posted by: cranky pants | Nov 28, 2017 09:51

Zing zing...

Posted by: Archangel | Nov 28, 2017 12:20

Based on the most recent comments, I thought  would share this little fun fact:

Porcupines produce a noxious odor and chatter or clack their teeth as a warning sign. Contrary to popular belief, porcupines do not throw their quills. Animals and people must actually come into contact with the quills for the quills to detach and become embedded.

That aside, I would have to agree with momof2. Mrs.Smith, I too appreciate your thoughtful and rational responses.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 28, 2017 13:02

Andrea, same here.  The 4-day weekend was busy. Here are some random thoughts back:


I wouldn't say that you know enough about me to comment on my value system. As a journalist you know that someone's style is just their style.  I certainly have a biased style but that is totally separate from my value system. I feel it would be fairer to say that our perspectives are very different…or our writing styles are very different, not our values.  That cannot be determined here.


I shouldn't have been cliché.  I apologize.  I should have just asked you if you got out much in Wareham in your late teens, 20s, 30s, & 40s and mixed in with the element to really get a good whiff of this place.  I did, and I still occasionally do.  You didn’t and don’t.  I knew I was on to something.  I’m glad that you said where you were from for most of your life. Now I know why we disagree. This place is a trip!  It’s like nowhere else. It cannot be compared to urban locations. It cannot be compared to suburban locations. It cannot be compared to rural locations.  It’s Wareham. Your volunteering is admirable, but those people probably wanted help and were appreciative…unlike the majority around here.


I’m always willing to believe that maybe things have changed over the years.  Now, with school-aged kids I see and hear about the most darned things…the same darned things that I saw and heard in the late 1980s when I started gathering the facts to form my basis. Some things just never change.


I too come from a Boston suburb. Not quite like Needham.  A working-class town with subsidized housing.  We called them “projects” growing up but I’ve been told that is no longer a PC term.  A town with military housing as well.  Two high-schools, each had twice the students of Wareham High.  A lot of cottages around the water.  Neighborhoods with potential to be just like Wareham.  It didn’t have extremely wealthy seaside mansions to offset the stats either.  The demographics were and still are worse than Wareham’s.   The town had more than twice the population of Wareham and probably twice as many low-income people; yet very little Wareham-like scenarios. Is “Wareham-like” an acceptable adjective (as opposed to the one that ends in Y)?



I think you mixed in a few comments from other commenters up there because I've never criticized someone just for having a food assistance card. There is nothing wrong with an appreciative struggling family using EBT for their 3 squares. I have voiced opinion when an entitled system abuser has a carriage full of Ben n Jerry's, Ho- Hos, and filet mignon…but that doesn’t make me a monster.   And I've never stated anything about a baby stroller; that wasn’t me.  I feel like you are associating all negative comments with me…lol…am I being stereotyped?


Now that you mention strollers, I coincidently have a story that fits the territory.  I was driving up from Swifts the other evening in the dark.  There, in front of the infamous Woods, I saw what looked like two little girls with dollies in umbrella strollers.  They were standing perpendicular to the road, in the entry, with the strollers completely in the road!  I thought to myself that they could never be real babies because who would ever stand back on the side of a dark road with their babies in harm’s way!  I hit the high beams.  I was wrong, it wasn’t little girls with dollies, it was two young mothers with real babies!  Highly doubtful they were big sisters or babysitters!  How stupid!  How sad! I stopped, thinking they wanted to cross.  They just stayed there and waved me off. I wanted to stop and say something.  Some advice on safety from one parent to another.  But you know how that would have been received…” who is you to tell me how to raze my kid!!!!!!”.  Or worse, I’d get accused of something.  Just keep driving WBTS, this is Wareham!  After all, that was just living proof of the saying, “they don’t wearem in Warem”.  Sorry for that doozie of a saying…but it’s my style.  Doesn’t make me a bad person or reflect my values.  If I didn’t make light of it, I’d cry about it.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 29, 2017 09:45

Swifty – You have absolutely no concept of the degree to which my volunteer work in one of the most poverty stricken and crime ridden areas of Boston exposed me to the harsh realities of life for those who live in poverty. As for your implication that “living in Needham” would render me incapable of understanding poverty, it’s absolutely ludicrous and yet another stellar example of stereotyping a person based upon the location where they live. Every day there are residents of Needham and similar towns whose work and/or volunteerism takes them beyond the borders of the towns in which they live and into some of the state's most poverty stricken and crime ridden areas.  Included among those people, members of professions such as medicine, education, and social services, and people who volunteer through charities and/oror faith-based efforts. And you think because of some preconceived bias regarding the town in which they live, or an assumption about the income they earn that they are incapable of understanding poverty?

Posted by: Swifts_Sheriff | Nov 29, 2017 11:17

Smitty , yeah there are lots of Ghettos in Needham lol ... Yeah I was just at the Glover the other day and was commenting about all the homeless people in the center ... Give me a break

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 29, 2017 12:41

Swifty - I'm so sorry, in my haste to respond to your comment, I neglected to include within my most recent comment a reminder of an essential fact stated in an earlier comment that I posted. That fact being, are you ready...my volunteer work was done in (inside the physical area of) one of the most poverty stricken and crime ridden areas of Boston. Thank you for pointing out my mistake to me. I have edited the comment which you misunderstood and added to it the additional information necessary in order for the comment's message to be completely understood.


By the way, the name of the hospital you visited in Needham the other day is Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, Needham. It hasn't been called Glover Hospital for somewhere around 20 years.


As an aside, next time you are visiting Needham, stop by the Needham Community Council and ask them about Needham's hidden, and not-so hidden, poor, and the services and assistance the Council provides for them, including a food pantry and a thrift shop. If you're not going to be in Needham any time soon, you can find the information by doing an online search for Needham Community Council.


Again thank you for directing my attention to the fact that I had in haste, omitted information essential to a complete understanding of my comment. Enjoy the rest of your day.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 29, 2017 13:22

Wareham is not poverty stricken or crime ridden.  Even though I carry on about it, it's not like that.  It can't be compared to places that are.  Your experience in such places is admirable and impressive but it does not make you an expert on all things Wareham.  That's what I've been trying to express.


The low-income in Wareham aren't "poverty stricken".  Poverty stricken makes me think of Unicef children with distended bellies and flies buzzing around.  It ain't that bad.  Crime Ridden makes me think of Chicago.  Wareham has stupid crime like Mario Ogletree with drugs and a closet full of sneakers or that dumb woman with the orb on her head shoplifting at Stop & Steal. It ain't that bad...it's Wareham.  A place all by itself!


Hey Wareham Week.  What's the record for longest comment string?  This one has been going strong!

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 29, 2017 13:54

Comment removed. For some unknown reason it posted twice.

Posted by: Andrea Smith | Nov 29, 2017 13:54

Wareham by the Sea – The following is in response to a comment which you directed to me and posted Nov 28, 2017 13:02

You’re not “on to something.” You’ve just jumped to an incorrect conclusion based upon my response to your vague cliché.

In response to what you now say you “should have asked”…. During the first 57 years of my life, I lived in Needham. My life experiences during that period were not limited to experiences within the town of Needham. I also spent considerable time in Wareham, and in so doing formed lifelong friendships with year-round residents of Wareham, many of whom were employed in Wareham. A combination of experiences in Wareham during the first 57 years of my life as an individual; shared experiences with Wareham residents; and a long-held fascinations for local news and research related to local news, provided the initial basis for my knowledge of Wareham’s unique characteristics and problems.

In 2004, my husband and I sold our home in Needham, purchased a home in Wareham, and became official “year-round” residents of Wareham. Experiences since moving to Wareham have further increased my knowledge of Wareham’s unique characteristics and problems. Among those experiences: time spent as a volunteer at Turning Point, (Wareham’s Day Resource Center for the Homeless and Near-Homeless), employment in local retail (an industry in which full-time income is often insufficient to meet life’s necessities) and several years as a local journalist during which I researched and reported on a number of issues impacting Wareham, among them (but not limited to) poverty, under-employment, low-income employment and affordable housing.

Also worthy of mention regarding my understanding of poverty – 12 years of personal volunteer experience during which my volunteerism brought me into the neighborhoods, schools and homes of one of the poorest, most crime ridden areas of Boston.

As for the rest of the comment that you posted Nov 28, 2017 13:02 ….same old, same old: a dash of nice guy; a few bias-based zingers, a phrase or two to shock those you know would consider the wording offensive; and the inevitable “bait for debate.” Nothing new.

Posted by: Swifts_Sheriff | Nov 29, 2017 14:47

Smitty, it will always be the Glover .... Just like the Faulkner will be the Faulkner ... ... Nice that you made your way into the inner city and volunteered. Some of us still volunteer .... Thank you for your service !!

Posted by: Archangel | Nov 29, 2017 17:28

WBTS, I have copied and pasted your entire post to Andrea Smith from above. Please note the sections I have bolded. I find it  astounding that you can sit in judgment of anyone whom you think is beneath  you or your alleged value system and then claim that Andrea Smith doesn’t seem to know enough about you. What is crystal clear, having read many of your posts, is that you are a bully.


The other thing that is crystal clear is that you’ve always got a story. Take the following comment as an example:


“I should have just asked you if you got out much in Wareham in your late teens, 20s, 30s, & 40s and mixed in with the element to really get a good whiff of this place.  I did, and I still occasionally do. “


I mean…Really? Either you expect us to believe that you are conducting some deep throat type investigation, or you are socializing with the very “element” which you so despise. Either way, I think Andrea Smith has had you pegged as troll from the start.


POSTED BY: WAREHAM BY THE SEA | Nov 28, 2017 13:02

Andrea, same here.  The 4-day weekend was busy. Here are some random thoughts back:




I wouldn't say that you know enough about me to comment on my value system. As a journalist you know that someone's style is just their style.  I certainly have a biased style but that is totally separate from my value system. I feel it would be fairer to say that our perspectives are very different…or our writing styles are very different, not our values.  That cannot be determined here.




I shouldn't have been cliché.  I apologize.  I should have just asked you if you got out much in Wareham in your late teens, 20s, 30s, & 40s and mixed in with the element to really get a good whiff of this place.  I did, and I still occasionally do. You didn’t and don’t.  I knew I was on to something.  I’m glad that you said where you were from for most of your life. Now I know why we disagree. This place is a trip!  It’s like nowhere else. It cannot be compared to urban locations. It cannot be compared to suburban locations. It cannot be compared to rural locations.  It’s Wareham. Your volunteering is admirable, but those people probably wanted help and were appreciative…unlike the majority around here.




I’m always willing to believe that maybe things have changed over the years.  Now, with school-aged kids I see and hear about the most darned things…the same darned things that I saw and heard in the late 1980s when I started gathering the facts to form my basis. Some things just never change.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 29, 2017 21:19


Bully...a bully...you’re calling me that overused word. That’s a mean kid on the playground.  As far as I’m concerned that should be the extent of that word’s use.  According to Websters that word means a lot more, I’m aware of its full definition.  However, the last time I dealt with a bully was in the 5th grade.


Troll...a troll...you too are calling me a mythological creature of Scandinavian folklore.  Come on.  If were were sitting together in lawn chairs in my back yard I’d be giving you a hard time.  It’s my nature.  Don’t take me so literally.  Read between the lines.  I don’t need to comment on here.  I enjoy it.  I don’t make things up but my style tends to rile up those that swallow it whole.


Despise...I don’t despise.  Please don’t put words in my mouth.  I don’t despise anybody.  I am frustrated by the actions of many.  But I don’t despise them.


Maybe I do have a few shady friends.  Maybe I’m some kind of investigator. Maybe I’m a bartender.  Maybe I’m involved with my church, maybe I conduct business in town.  Maybe I’m all of these. Maybe I’m some. Maybe none. Does it matter?

Posted by: Swifts_Sheriff | Nov 30, 2017 08:40

Wareham is far from Crime Ridden . Stupid, Dumb crimes yes . As far as poverty goes if you are smoking butts and tell me you're poor, please don't talk to me . The average price of cigarettes in Massachusetts is $9.95 a pack with the average yearly cost of $3,633 .. That's 3 months rent . That's what I see when I drive down Swifts Beach road outside of the Woods people standing out there waiting for the school bus Ripping Butts or when I go into the Country Market and they are buying $ 10 scratches and butts  and you see the same people day after day . Proverty, when you drive by one of those motels on Cranberry Highway and you see a boat parked outside one of the rooms . If I was forced to live in one of those places the one thing I wouldn't be owning is a Boat. It's called Laziness society has made it too easy for people to get social services. Yes there are truly people who are down on their luck and for reasons beyond their control they are in the situation they are in . I feel for those people , but for the ones who have nobody to blame but themselves for the situation they are in sorry no sympathy here.

Posted by: cranky pants | Nov 30, 2017 09:58

Just because you rubbed elbows with people more or less fortunate than you doesn't justify you saying you know how they live. You might see how they interact, but not how they live.

I've worked in rehabilitation facilities, and I've spent years working with developmental services yet I wouldn't go clowning and saying I know the life they live. I understand their situation, but I could never put myself in those shoes and say I understand life.

You guys really got the wind blowing in here now.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 30, 2017 10:25

Swift, it's funny because it sounds like we see the same things and share the same thoughts.  You forgot the iPhones and the $5 cups of coffee!  Add that up and tack it on the $3,633 for butts.  A basic phone and a Mr. Coffee maker and they'd save another $3600.


Welfare requirements should include:


  • Regular Drug Tests - I need one for work for my income.
  • Financial Advisor - manages the way they spend & save it.
  • Nutritionist - Less HoHo, more apples!
  • Family Planning -  Birds don't lay eggs without a nest...why do humans?
Give someone a fish and they eat for a day.  Teach someone how to fish and they eat for a lifetime.  So simple.  So true.


Posted by: Archangel | Nov 30, 2017 16:36

WBTS,  maybe I should have said that you are the bully-type or that you are bully-like. Would those be more acceptable terms? Maybe I should’ve also said that your posts are troll-like. Would that be more acceptable?


First, you tell me to “read between the lines” and then you tell me “not to put words in your mouth”. Well, I have been reading between the lines, WBTS. I also have no need to put “words in your mouth”, WBTS, you do a fine job of expressing how much you “despise” the “element” that you have and continue to associate with. Have you told your “shady” friends how you feel about them and have you considered that hanging out with them might make you…Well…Warehamy?


You have come straight out and admitted to socializing with the “element” so, if you believe in guilt by association or generalizations, that makes you part of the “element.” Not much room for maybes there.

Posted by: Archangel | Nov 30, 2017 16:50

  • "Family Planning -  Birds don't lay eggs without a nest...why do humans?" Uhm... because humans don't lay eggs? LMAO

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 30, 2017 17:46

You got me there...I thought they did.

Posted by: Archangel | Nov 30, 2017 17:55

Just too good to pass up. While we may be miles apart on certain things, people have got to have a good chuckle once in a while.

Posted by: Wareham By The Sea | Nov 30, 2017 18:18

Yep, sort of why I comment on here in the first place.  It's entertaining.  With Christmas coming and all, I may tone it down a bit (unless something really good happens...lol).  Maintaining WBTS's negativity can get exhausting!

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